Is Hip-Hop a culture?

[G1veU$U$Free]

you fucking busters!

everything Mayor has said regarding 'Hip-Hop' can be said regarding American Culture, Lithuanian Culture, African Culture, African-American Culture, Russian Culture, Finnish Culture, etc, etc.

I don't have nearly enough patience to break this thing down to a science and neither will most who don't get paid to do so.

'Hip-Hop' may not have the strength that other cultures posess, but that does not make it NOT a culture.

[The_Mayor]

lol.... how is it the same?

one of the primary goals of African-American culture is to have equal treatment to the majority race in the US, and not be judged unfairly based on skin color...

^ how is that the same as a cat who talks about how great of a lyricist he is or how many girls he fucked or how many ppl hes killed? these are the type of artists that get promoted on here as being some of the best out now and best ever in the business... how is that the same as spinnin a record, or breakdancin, or doin graffitti, or saying some lyrics? yes, 'hip-hop' has aspects of real cultures, but it itself is not one imo

and 80 some odd posts later, i STILL have yet to see what hip-hop's goals and beliefs are.... not what the ppl who get involved in it hope to achieve by gettin involved in it, but what the classification itself strives to do and become

[Grove~Ryda]

ur idea of "Culture" seems highly misconstrued, as u may have missed the post below, u cant just be askin for specific goals and beliefs within such a broad based culture. 'Rappin' as u seem to b focused on is merely 20% of what hiphop as a culture embodies.

I get ur point Mayor and I dont kno about listin hiphop's goals n beliefs cuz its as vague of an issue as to say 'whats the American Dream'??? The question will foreva remain rhetoric in a generic sense unless specified by an individual, be him/her a DJ or a breakdancer, respective of each of their careers, they will ultimately have different goals and beliefs, just as a lawyer or a doctor but in the end, they will all b lookin forward to the biggest hypothesis of all time which is 'The American Dream'

[Serius]

seems like this has turned more towards a philosophical debate than an actual definition of what hip hop is as a culture...and since i'm taking philosophy and i'm high strung on aristotle, plato, socrates, Neitzche, and other...i may have to post somethign rather soon....

[The_Mayor]

ur idea of "Culture" seems highly misconstrued, as u may have missed the post below, u cant just be askin for specific goals and beliefs within such a broad based culture. 'Rappin' as u seem to b focused on is merely 20% of what hiphop as a culture embodies.

nah i didnt miss it.... and i already posed the questions to the other aspects of 'hip-hop' ... from the elements to the trends, what purpose does each one serve to actually benefit the so-called 'culture'? if you dont think they dont 'benefit' it and are simply parts of what make it what it is, then why does the term 'real hip-hop' even exist at all? any idiot can see that breakdancing was bound to die out and that graffiti was destined to become a target by the feds for defacing private property... that leaves mc'ing/rapping and dj'ing... both of which still exist today... ppl say what they wanna say on the mic and dj's still scratch records/cds in clubs and parties - so if that's the 'culture', how can it be dead? imo its sounds more like a specific movement dying, rather than a culture...

the other pt i brought up was 'hip-hop' relations to other real cultures... example: American culture is based on the American way of life, right? well if an American citizen does something different than other Americans, like someone that doesnt watch sports in the US for instance - no one says that he/she is not an American and no citizenships are taken away for not watchin sports....same goes across the board for the litany of other real cultures

on the other hand, what does 'hip-hop' do? it seperates itself from what IS and ISNT part of the 'culture' to the point of isolation and borderline segregation - even when its clear that the differing styles, lyrics, beats, dances, and dress that embody 'hip-hop' are rooted in the exact same area as the other shit, but just expressed a lil differently....

i didnt wanna harp on the point that was made earlier, but the argument could EASILY be made that REAL 'hip-hop' is expression from only lower class Blacks in the NYC area... everything else that followed (from the diff cities, styles, dress, slang, and races that joined later) is NOT 'real hip-hop' because it was never included in the first place....

^ now if you dont agree with that (which is prefectly understandable), and you believe that all races, cities, slangs, styles of dress, etc that want to come into 'hip-hop' are well within their rights to join the party, then that means you also MUST included the artists and styles in the industry that you would normally say arent 'real hip-hop' (because they do it differently, for better or worse) whether you or anyone else likes it or not....

bottom line: if you consider (insert hip-hop artist, activity, or trend) to be a real 'hip-hop', then you hav to include EVERYONE whos got ANY of the criteria for it....and hip-hop fans wont do it, even when chances are that they themselves arent part of what hockey fans refer to 'the original six'... its more like a fraternity than a culture imo

[Serius]

Here's an interesting read from Afrika Bambataa..




Hip-Hop vs Hip-Hop (Take it for what it is).

I, Afrika Bambaataa, have heard it all, read it all, in many magazines throughout the world, and seen almost all in this continuing bullshit about which rappers are better, east coast v west coast, Miami bass hip-hop is bullshit, British Rappers sound funny rapping, electro funk, techno rappers are soft, I like hardcore rap and beats, this one group is like that, old school vs new school, Rap wouldn`t be rap if it wasn`t for the battles, I`m the quickest, baddest rapper, deejay around, Go Go music in Washington D. C. is dead. It`s all about hip-house or house music all night long. I dis you, you dis me, my crew will take you out or kick your ass, fuck this or that, Nigger, Bitch, Nigguz, Nigguh, Hoe, Hooker, Bitches with Problems, Hoes with Attitudes. Just look at yourselves, sounding like a bunch of fools, who really don`t have any true knowledge of self and knowledge of hip-hop culture and what it`s all about.

First of all, let me tell you that the music (beats) that makes up hip-hop, comes from different nationalities and races, especially from black people, and if you think I am a brother who don`t know what he is talking about, just check out many of the music, beats, grooves and sounds that many of your rappers use to make their records or rap over. Hip-hop music in general is colorless and not racist.

It comes from many categories in music, for example: Hip-hop music is made up from other forms of music like funk, soul, rhythm & blues, jazz, rock heavy metal, salsa, soca (calypso), TV shows, kiddie shows, horror movies, techno, pop, disco, african, arabic, reggae -etc. . . . and if you use any records from these categories, you will see that the music is made by people from different races or nationalities from all over the planet, but it`s roots start with black people.

I have read many interviews by different rap groups throughout the world, just to see where their heads are at, whether they are really knowledgeable about hip-hop music/culture or whether they are just plain assholes. Many of the rappers will down(dis) another rapper because he or she wanted to experiment with hip-hop by singing or adding a different sound in hip-hop to create something new.

When are all of you in the hip-hop world going to "wake up"? You love to keep dissing each other for nothing and if you were wise in your disrespect of each other, you would know how to make money with respecting your disrespect of each other, if you truly understand what I am saying. Many who are into hip-hop or part of hip-hop culture throughout the world need a check up from the neck up.

In fact, and in truth, the whole human family needs one. Everyone needs to check up on their own roots and culture and seek the real truths on life on this so-called planet Earth. Knowledge, wisdom, and understanding, facts and truths about black, brown, red, yellow and white people and not that brainwash white supremacy shit that white people in power have taught all over the world and to their own people of the so called planet Earth.

Yes there are many wrongs in the worldwide hip-hop community, but there are also many aspects of positivity within the hip-hop community that the media or trade magazines rarely focus upon. Many of you in hip-hop culture don`t even listen to the rappers who are trying hard to wake your asses up to what is going on in the bigger scale than of what you see in your neighborhoods, their message goes in one ear and out the other.

The media does play a big role in destroying the hip-hop culture movement, but many of you in the hip-hop community are the biggest enemies of hip-hop and you will be the ones who will help the enemies of hip-hop to destroy it, or to bring it back underground, because of your ignorance of knowledge of hip-hop. This has started the difference between "old school" and "new school".

To myself (Afrika Bambaataa) there is only one school and that`s the learning, evolving, going through the different phases or cycles school of hip-hop. That is the real hip-hop school. A lot of you in the world of hip-hop better start looking at the problems in your own backyard as well as the world, because while you are enjoying yourselves etc. there are many plots being sprung to destroy hip-hop in the world.

Because many people in government look at hip-hop music and its culture as a radical music that gets straight to the point and music that will wake up the youth and young adults throughout the world. They can also use hip-hop to backfire and destroy itself. You can believe what I`m saying. But time will tell and I see what you see not.

Peace be unto you,

Your brother In music and faith, Afrika Bambaataa.

[The_Mayor]

Here's an interesting read from Afrika Bambataa..




Hip-Hop vs Hip-Hop (Take it for what it is).

I, Afrika Bambaataa, have heard it all, read it all, in many magazines throughout the world, and seen almost all in this continuing bullshit about which rappers are better, east coast v west coast, Miami bass hip-hop is bullshit, British Rappers sound funny rapping, electro funk, techno rappers are soft, I like hardcore rap and beats, this one group is like that, old school vs new school, Rap wouldn`t be rap if it wasn`t for the battles, I`m the quickest, baddest rapper, deejay around, Go Go music in Washington D. C. is dead. It`s all about hip-house or house music all night long. I dis you, you dis me, my crew will take you out or kick your ass, fuck this or that, Nigger, Bitch, Nigguz, Nigguh, Hoe, Hooker, Bitches with Problems, Hoes with Attitudes. Just look at yourselves, sounding like a bunch of fools, who really don`t have any true knowledge of self and knowledge of hip-hop culture and what it`s all about.

First of all, let me tell you that the music (beats) that makes up hip-hop, comes from different nationalities and races, especially from black people, and if you think I am a brother who don`t know what he is talking about, just check out many of the music, beats, grooves and sounds that many of your rappers use to make their records or rap over. Hip-hop music in general is colorless and not racist.

It comes from many categories in music, for example: Hip-hop music is made up from other forms of music like funk, soul, rhythm & blues, jazz, rock heavy metal, salsa, soca (calypso), TV shows, kiddie shows, horror movies, techno, pop, disco, african, arabic, reggae -etc. . . . and if you use any records from these categories, you will see that the music is made by people from different races or nationalities from all over the planet, but it`s roots start with black people.

I have read many interviews by different rap groups throughout the world, just to see where their heads are at, whether they are really knowledgeable about hip-hop music/culture or whether they are just plain assholes. Many of the rappers will down(dis) another rapper because he or she wanted to experiment with hip-hop by singing or adding a different sound in hip-hop to create something new.

When are all of you in the hip-hop world going to "wake up"? You love to keep dissing each other for nothing and if you were wise in your disrespect of each other, you would know how to make money with respecting your disrespect of each other, if you truly understand what I am saying. Many who are into hip-hop or part of hip-hop culture throughout the world need a check up from the neck up.

In fact, and in truth, the whole human family needs one. Everyone needs to check up on their own roots and culture and seek the real truths on life on this so-called planet Earth. Knowledge, wisdom, and understanding, facts and truths about black, brown, red, yellow and white people and not that brainwash white supremacy shit that white people in power have taught all over the world and to their own people of the so called planet Earth.

Yes there are many wrongs in the worldwide hip-hop community, but there are also many aspects of positivity within the hip-hop community that the media or trade magazines rarely focus upon. Many of you in hip-hop culture don`t even listen to the rappers who are trying hard to wake your asses up to what is going on in the bigger scale than of what you see in your neighborhoods, their message goes in one ear and out the other.

The media does play a big role in destroying the hip-hop culture movement, but many of you in the hip-hop community are the biggest enemies of hip-hop and you will be the ones who will help the enemies of hip-hop to destroy it, or to bring it back underground, because of your ignorance of knowledge of hip-hop. This has started the difference between "old school" and "new school".

To myself (Afrika Bambaataa) there is only one school and that`s the learning, evolving, going through the different phases or cycles school of hip-hop. That is the real hip-hop school. A lot of you in the world of hip-hop better start looking at the problems in your own backyard as well as the world, because while you are enjoying yourselves etc. there are many plots being sprung to destroy hip-hop in the world.

Because many people in government look at hip-hop music and its culture as a radical music that gets straight to the point and music that will wake up the youth and young adults throughout the world. They can also use hip-hop to backfire and destroy itself. You can believe what I`m saying. But time will tell and I see what you see not.

Peace be unto you,

Your brother In music and faith, Afrika Bambaataa.

i can agree with this... but the sad thing is that many folks on here will read this and be REAL QUICK to cosign and not even realize that by doin so will make them hypocrites for supporting MOST of the so-called 'real hip-hop' artists that they listen to....lol

he basically said that anything talkin bout guns, women, drugs, murder, who's the better lyricist, block battles, diss records, and anything else that DOES NOT consist of 100% educational enlightenment of the whole is NOT apart of hip-hop....so all these mixtape rappers and other tough talkin mcs yall adore just got kicked out by Bambataa lol

and for the record, i dont care if my preferred artists arent included... i accept it as music, no more no less and always have... if i wanna get educated on whats really goin on in my community, then ill check for michael eric dyson, tavis smiley, cornell west and not some rapper who cant even finish high school lol

[Bloods & Crips]

the sad thing is that many will read this and be REAL QUICK to cosign and not even realize that by doin so will make them hypocrites for supporting MOST of the artists they listen to....lol

he basically said that anything talkin bout guns, women, drugs, murder, who's the better lyricist, block battles, diss records, and anything else that DOES NOT consist of 100% educational enlightenment of the whole is NOT apart of hip-hop....so all these mixtape rappers and other tough talkin mcs yall adore just got kicked out by Bambataa lol

and for the record, i dont care if my preferred artists arent included... i accept it as music, no more no less and always have... if i wanna get educated on whats really goin on in my community, then ill check for michael eric dyson, tavis smiley, cornell west and not some rapper who cant even finish high school lol

that includes you, Mayor, you support dirty south rappers, all they rap about is their grillz, being in the club with a shawty, how fly they are etc

[Kizzang]

that includes you, Mayor, you support dirty south rappers, all they rap about is their grillz, being in the club with a shawty, how fly they are etc

well your not an idiot.

[The_Mayor]

that includes you, Mayor, you support dirty south rappers, all they rap about is their grillz, being in the club with a shawty, how fly they are etc

dumb bastards need to learn how to read... i wrote that same post that i didnt consider myself to be in the 'culture' because i don't believe it even is a culture... the jackasses who readily use the phrase 'real hip-hop' are the ones who i was directing it towards.... the biased faggots... the anti-south faggots who wish they were from new york and act the part because their area has no identity or relevance in 'hip-hop'....

^ now if you feel that applies to you, so be it... but i personally could give a rats ass about 'hip-hop culture' simply because half of it doesnt know what the fuck it wants to be and the other half doesnt want anyone except carbon-copy new yorkers in it... sorry, but yall can have that shit... i listen to everybodys music from every region and style... so ill just stick to the music i like and anybody who dont like it cant catch aids and die a slow one

now normally, id might consider just goin ahead and start generalizin your region/country since thats the weak-minded, childish shit that youve resorted to, but ill pass.....

[london2nyc]

No, its not a culture.....sorry, kids... stretch it and contort it all you want but it's not a culture

LOL!

i disagree with this statement 150%....the level of bias in 'hip-hop' could make the ku klux klan cringe

The level of bias in Hip-Hop is taking the view of the mainstream, however Hip-Hop as a genre (not as something on tv) has transcended that.

[Bloods & Crips]

now normally, id might consider just goin ahead and start generalizin your region/country since thats the weak-minded, childish shit that youve resorted to, but ill pass.....

Honestly Mayor dont get mad, Im not generalizin, Im just being real, you describe to me what an average rapper from the south raps about,

you cant deny the fact that most rappers from the south most of their music lacks content

[The_Mayor]

The level of bias in Hip-Hop is taking the view of the mainstream, however Hip-Hop as a genre (not as something on tv) has transcended that.

are you saying that no there's visible bias beyond the mainstream form of the music?

Honestly Mayor dont get mad, Im not generalizin, Im just being real, you describe to me what an average rapper from the south raps about,

you cant deny the fact that most rappers from the south most of their music lacks content

lol does it matter?... clearly once again, youve missed the point... generalizing solves nothing, especially when your particular opinion is completely irrelevant... no ones mad lol... just called it like i saw it

do all white ppl like bologna and cant dance? are all black ppl lazy and eat watermelon? do all asians and oriental ppl know karate and eat rice 24/7? are all muslims terrorists? did all mexican-americans jump a fence or float in a boat?

if ignorance were pennies, dejek and fiasco would make millions off this site....

[london2nyc]

lol.... how is it the same?

one of the primary goals of African-American culture is to have equal treatment to the majority race in the US, and not be judged unfairly based on skin color...

^ how is that the same as a cat who talks about how great of a lyricist he is or how many girls he fucked or how many ppl hes killed? these are the type of artists that get promoted on here as being some of the best out now and best ever in the business... how is that the same as spinnin a record, or breakdancin, or doin graffitti, or saying some lyrics? yes, 'hip-hop' has aspects of real cultures, but it itself is not one imo

and 80 some odd posts later, i STILL have yet to see what hip-hop's goals and beliefs are.... not what the ppl who get involved in it hope to achieve by gettin involved in it, but what the classification itself strives to do and become

I think Hip-Hop coming from a mindframe of a hip-hop head (conscious vs. unconscious) seeks to be a culture because it puts it on a higher plateau. It becomes more than just music. It has history, i.e. Cedric & Cedar Park, It has gods, i.e. Kool Herc, Africa Bambatta, It has scriptures which is the early music itself (a new form of communicating beliefs) not to mention the graffitti which to this day decorates every subway tunnel in NYC. It demands participation i.e actively participating with the four elements or just listening and watching. Hip-Hop elements draw our senses, first of all our ears, our eyes and to a certain degree we feel hip-hop in our skin.

However, Hip-Hop culture taken in the manner I just described is idealistic because the culture has been so clouded with other things. Such as the migration of Hip-Hop. When Hip-Hop left NYC it didn't all leave in a nice little 4element combo pack to Atlanta or Los Angeles. It left an element at a time, and more than that, emphasis on different elements. For instance a lot of the graffiti culture moved overseas to Europe and Asia. In the US we saw the emergence and proliferation of Rap music which is the element of emceeing. Also as it migrated it morphed. For instance in the South hip-hop has morphed into "crunk muzik" and "snap" music. Hip-Hop has also merged with R&B. Akon is found in the Hip-Hop section in stores. I think it's a natural phenomena for Hip-Hop to be morphed, since every city/state/country wants to make Hip-Hop there own. Or in a sense create something new. So the question is has the culture expanded? Or has the culture been lost as soon as it left NYC? And, is the culture I described in the beginning the culture to begin with. The reason I say that is when you look at the Roman empire which lasted hundreds of years, people often look at it as a singular event, even if when broken down they are seperate events, i.e first 5 years, second 5 years. Will Hip-Hop be looked at as a singular event? Or broken down, into different timeframes? Because if Hip-Hop were to last 1000 years or more which I hope it does, the timeframe we are in right now will be the foundation. Therefore it may be possible for someone in the future to look back at Hip-Hop music and think that Young Jeezy or the Ying Yang Twins were pioneers because they sold millions of records. Is that neccesarily a bad thing?

[R<O>D]

Of course it is OP,but if you was wanting to start a thread and have a adult and deep reflective conversation,you have most certainly come to the wrong site.I mean look at how much love Young Jeezy gets on this forum??.This is not the most intellectual of Hip Hop sites...

shit, i could go into detail on why i think its a culture e.g clothes, attitude, lifestyle etc but i just cant be arsed and its one of those repeatitive threads that drones on for about 10 pages and no one bothers reading your response anyway

[london2nyc]

shit, i could go into detail on why i think its a culture e.g clothes, attitude, lifestyle etc but i just cant be arsed and its one of those repeatitive threads that drones on for about 10 pages and no one bothers reading your response anyway

Just to let you know... I read yours, pity it was off topic, lol.

[london2nyc]

are you saying that no there's visible bias beyond the mainstream form of the music?

....

I'm saying that including the other 4 elements of Hip-Hop their isn't discrimination in the form of age, race, sex, political leanings, sexual orientation which bar's entry into participating in hip-hop. However how the masses perceive you; is another question entirely.

[Grove~Ryda]

Mayor yet again I c ur point, but hailin from the south end, ur frustration is understood, deez NYC rappers aint promotin the culture as such, like bboyin for instance has turned from head spinnin on a cardboard to gettin ur head spun on crack on a cardboard. Its like James Brown risin from the dead n tellin MJ "ay yo ur moonwalk is shit" n then falls back to ghost ridin his coffin. R.I.P. Mr Brown!. Yet again, as drehype pointed out, its still a buddin culture as it only started a mere 20 odd years ago, the African-American Culture has been for eons n the "fruitfulness" still remains tacky. So we in the sense we shud still embrace it as a Culture nonetheless. Sum1 also pointed out that hiphop is existent worldwide n its got positive focus in most regions, even in Africa. Lets forget abt whats 'real' and whats 'not real', lets focus on it bein a major part of 'Black and White' and use its positive side as Accolade. Excludin it as a Culture is kinda givin up on wat primarily started out to b, which wz to unite Ghetto kids n harmony with art & music.

[Serius]

Tony Touch Promotes the Culture......

[G1veU$U$Free]

Mayor, you are on this 'hip-hop' forum 'religiously'... stating your 'beliefs' on 'hip-hop'... commenting on 'hip-hop' member's 'art'...

should i go on?

we've explained what culture is... maybe we should explain what denial is.